Back to the Classroom, with Doug Ferguson

In this episode of Unpacking Education, Doug Ferguson, a National Board Certified Teacher, shares his journey back to the classroom. After an initial 10 years of teaching in an elementary classroom, Doug transitioned to educational leadership and curriculum design. Two years ago, Doug returned to his roots, teaching fifth-grade math and science. From reigniting classroom connections to building student belief through STEM, Doug’s story is a timely reminder that returning to the heart of teaching can be both humbling and deeply rewarding. Visit AVID Open Access to learn more.

Transcript

Doug Ferguson 0:00 It's like, it's like riding a bike, except the bike's on fire. You're on fire. Everything's on fire, right? Because it's the urgency of, like, I got to do all these things, and I have, you know, this classroom full of people dependent upon me, that I got to make sure I'm meeting as many needs as I can.

Rena Clark 0:17 The topic for today's podcast is back to the classroom with Doug Ferguson.

Rena Clark 0:23 Unpacking Education is brought to you by avid.org. AVID believes in seeing the potential of every student. To learn more about AVID, visit their website at avid.org.

Rena Clark 0:35 Welcome to Unpacking Education, the podcast where we explore current issues and best practices in education. I'm Rena Clark,

Paul Beckermann 0:46 I'm Paul Beckermann,

Winston Benjamin 0:48 and I'm Winston Benjamin. We are educators,

Paul Beckermann 0:51 and we're here to share insights and actionable strategies.

Transition Music with Rena's Children 0:56 Education is our passport to the future.

Rena Clark 1:01 Our quote for today is from Franklin Habit, and he says: "Teaching seems to require the sort of skills one would need to pilot a bus full of live chickens backwards with no brakes down a rocky road through the Andes while providing colorful and informative commentary on the scenery".

Rena Clark 1:21 There you go.

Paul Beckermann 1:25 Now, there's a quote right there.

Winston Benjamin 1:29 As a teacher, I'm like, yes and yes and yes. I think for me, it's, it's a funny way of acknowledging the complexity of teaching, right? To where it's literally you have so many different cultures, individuals, everything, and then you also have to make decisions on curriculum. You make an instant choice on, is this student upset about something that I really have to deal with, or can we talk about it later? It's so many decisions that have to be made in a split second, and it is impossible for a teacher, a human, anything, to get it correct every time. And I think with this, it really allows me to remember to give grace to our teachers and our individuals in the classroom, because all of that takes so much time, energy, and that's why, if you have you have friends who are teachers in the first couple of weeks, they're just dead and they don't want to talk to nobody. So it makes absolute sense.

Paul Beckermann 2:35 No kidding. And if somebody hasn't ever had the opportunity to be a teacher, I'm not sure that they will ever truly understand the degree to which that is the truth. And this probably good time for us to say at AVID Open Access, hey, teachers out there. We see you. We know that this is a really hard job, and we appreciate all the work you do and the difference you make in the lives of kids, because it is tough.

Rena Clark 3:02 Yeah, talk about decision fatigue when you come home. That's why I'm like, I just want to do nothing.

Rena Clark 3:10 Well, we're excited to welcome Doug Ferguson to our show. And Doug is a national board-certified teacher teaching in the Tahoma school district here in Washington State, where I am located. So, Doug, go ahead and introduce yourself, so your listeners can just get to know you. A little bit about you and your educational journey.

Doug Ferguson 3:29 Yeah, sure. Absolutely. Thanks, Rena. Yeah, no. Speaking about the real quick, about the exhaustion piece, I always think my theme song for September is Green Day's "Wake Me Up When September Ends". Gotta get through it. Yeah. So Doug Ferguson, and teaching in Tahoma school district. I teach fifth grade math and science, and loving it. It's my second year back in the classroom, and so far, so good.

Paul Beckermann 3:57 So you were, you were in the classroom, right, Doug, and then you, you had some district positions, and then you left school to do kind of some nonprofit work and came back. Do you want to just kind of give that little history?

Doug Ferguson 4:10 Yeah, absolutely. So, yes, I started out in the classroom. And actually, technically, I started out in finance. Teaching was a second career. Yeah, I was an assistant bond trader at Washington Mutual and felt it was sucking my soul dry, so maybe overcompensated, but went back to school, went to teaching, taught sixth grade elementary and fifth grade elementary for 10 years in the classroom, and then I was a STEM instructional coach at the elementary level, a little bit the district level, and then went to work at AVID doing the nonprofit education sector thing, and now I'm back in the classroom.

Winston Benjamin 4:47 Again. So here's a question. I'm always interested by career changers, right? Because it's like you got this one career, you can go into any other direction. Teach him anywhere, but you chose to become a teacher.

Doug Ferguson 5:10 Yeah, right.

Winston Benjamin 5:12 You get that question from all of those people who were in your former career asking you, "So what inspired you to become a teacher?" so that we can have a better understanding of the answer to that question.

Doug Ferguson 5:27 If you if you told me I was going to be a teacher in high school, I'd say you're crazy. I had no intention. And I went to college thinking I was going to actually do go into engineering, and I did a job site visit. I was like, "Yeah, I don't know if this is for me". And I had a meeting. Our career counselor from high school came out to visit a few of us over at my college, and he asked me to stay after the meeting. And he just kind of planted the seeds, you know, "Have you thought about becoming a teacher?" I was like, "Ah, I don't, you know," but that kind of stuck. And so I did take some education courses, dabbled, ended up going into to major in economics, did finance, and did a year of that. And I was like, I keep coming back. And I was doing some work with kids, and weekend, just volunteering and loving it. And I was like, gosh, you know, maybe I should do something with this full time. So that's kind of what, what got me going there. And I wasn't sure what I wanted to teach, and so I figured I would teach sixth grade, elementary, as high as I could, teach everything, and then figure it out, and then go, go up the ladder once I did, but I just kind of fell in love with elementary.

Paul Beckermann 6:53 So, speaking of figuring things out, Doug, so let's, let's take a look at those early formative years of teaching. What did you learn in those, you know, first years on the job that kind of really stuck with you and shaped your teaching career?

Doug Ferguson 7:06 Yeah, it was very formative those first years. I think every every teacher has stories about their first year in the classroom. My team of teachers, we were all first year teachers, so none of us knew what we were doing.

Rena Clark 7:11 Sorry, my face is like, what? That's a lot. Sixth grade teachers all new. Okay, yeah, sixth grade teachers all new.

Doug Ferguson 7:18 So, you know, we just used to joke. We're like, "What do we do?" "I don't know." "What do you think we should do?" "I don't know". And but it was, it was great, because we, like, we formed a really tight team, you know, because trial by fire, right? And we were all we'd gone through this program together, so we were teaching was a second career for all of us. So at least there was some life experience there that helped offset that and definitely taught me that you can't do this job on your own, right? You need all the help you can get. It's an impossible job, just like the quote was referencing the beginning, you just there's no way to get it all right.

And so I was fortunate in that where I taught, we had the most veteran counselor and special education team in the district where I was at. They each had like, at least 30 years of experience between them, and so I just leaned on them super heavily. Learned that a lot of what you would you do to support your your students who maybe had your biggest needs, right? That's actually more of a common denominator. It doesn't always sounds obvious with the other kids, but they benefit. So one of my big takeaways was, okay, if I'm doing something for one kid, it's probably more than one kid that's really going to benefit from that. And doing a class wide, let's see, other other things that you know, it's all about relationships, was kind of a big early, early takeaway.

I got involuntarily transferred. And so my principal, my second school, that was kind of his thing, and he really drilled into me. The first school I worked at was there was a lot of veterans, like really experienced teachers. And so when I got when I got bumped, it was actually like my my sixth year going to my seventh year, but I was low personal on the totem pole. This is what I was surprised by with teaching going in as I mean, I think we are a little naive in that first year, and I learning how much the job is behavior management and and then how much of it, if you can get out in front of that and be organized and, you know, work on your transitions and those things, then you can focus more on the teaching, but it's always thinking about that piece.

Paul Beckermann 9:23 Was there a time in there where you decided, yep, this was the right choice? I made the right move. I'm a teacher. Something that kind of you experienced when you were in the classroom that affirmed it?

Doug Ferguson 9:37 Yeah, I would say probably in about the last year, okay, the first 10 years were like, I think this is what I want to do. I don't know. And when I first started even my teaching program, I said I want to do 10 years in the classroom, and then I want to try, like, curriculum development or something. And so I kind of did that route. I knew I always wanted to come back and teach at some point, but really, being back in is kind of the second time around, really affirmed the kind of that love for the classroom and for teaching, like, "Yeah, this is what I was meant to do", but it's taken me 20 years to figure it out, for sure.

Rena Clark 10:13 Yeah, we're on on a different journey and different timetables, but so you're in the classroom about, probably, you said about 10 years, and then you transitioned into that STEM Integration Specialist, and I'm just curious, and our journeys are kind of similar, and just a fun fact, because Doug and I actually went to the same college, and I'm pretty sure you might have had my dad as a professor, fun fact, because he was an economics professor. Yeah, kind of fun, but we ran into each other years later, because, again, you are interweaving and find our way back to teaching, but just, just fun.

Paul Beckermann 10:53 But then you transition into that STEM, STEM Integration Specialist, and I'm just curious to tell us about kind of that new position. What drew you to make that change? How did that go? How'd you take those experiences from the classroom with you?

Doug Ferguson 11:08 Yeah, when I transferred schools and I ended up at the new school, I told my principal, he had me for four years, and then I was gonna I wanted. My plan was to transition into some sort of curriculum design or something. And every year was kind of like, "Okay, three more years," "All right, two more years," "All right, two more years," "All right, this is the year I'm gonna make the change," and he's like, "Well, what would keep you here?" and kind of concurrently, at the same time doing some discovery in terms of teaching. And I, I remember, like the exact moment I was in the classroom, I was giving my usual spiel. The kids were like, "Well, when are we going to need to learn this?" And I was always like, "Great question," you know? And I had my kind of canned spiels of like, "Hey, you know, you need to know fractions for this, or decimals for this, or inference for this". I just was like, "Why do you know?" And the kids were always very good about, okay, you know, we move on. But I was just like, "Okay, I if it's not obvious from what we're doing in the classroom why they're gonna need this at some point, I need to do more".

And so I went to my my principal. I proposed, actually, early on, that's the seventh years my when I was just starting out in fifth grade, this new school, again, all a new team. We were all we weren't new teachers. At that point, we were all new to fifth grade, so starting but that was like, you know, felt like a lot, lot of experience after having been a first year teacher, first year teachers, and the science scores we inherited were, like, 20% passing, like it was not good. So we kind of got a clean slate to do we wanted. And I went to principal and said, "Well, what about like, science to robotics, you know? Can we do, you know?" And he said, "Well, go write a proposal". Figure out, you know, something is we did a rotation, and once every three weeks, we shared the kids. And so the kids rotated through me to do the science robotics piece. And systems was really big in the state standards at that time. And that kind of started this journey of building on that, hey, STEM can be really powerful vehicle for showing kids why they're learning what they're learning.

And so then when that last year, and he's like, "What would it keep you in the in the classroom?" And I was like, "Well, I don't know that this job exists anywhere, but what I this is what I think if I could do some sort of like STEM integration coaching position or something along those lines, that's what would keep me". I was cutting the conversation. I moved on thinking, okay, you know, that's great. And my principal being my principal, and he's just an amazing principal administrator, and he, with some some help from some folks the district, he cobbled together funding for it, and and so. And he's like, "We can do it". I was like, what?

Paul Beckermann 12:13 Hey, it pays to dream.

Doug Ferguson 12:19 Yeah, it does sometimes. And so that's kind of what led to the position. And we had a lot of talks about it, and I reached out to somebody I knew that had been a pure science specialist, and just kind of for advice. And he said, "Don't, don't pull out, push in and co-teach". And so it was, instead of doing like, more a specialist model or traditional specialist model, it was more of a coaching, push in, co-teach, rotate, you know, co-develop with the teachers, because we didn't know how long the funding was going to last. I mean, who knows? And so that's how this position kind of grew and came about, and I found one other person in the state at the time that was doing a similar position, although it was more of a pull out specialist position. So he and I traded notes, and then the job kind of grew from there. And so we wrote grants. We applied to be a STEM Lighthouse school the first year. Application with the intent was to just get rejected, to figure out what we needed to learn and then grow. And to our surprise, we got accepted lots of surprises. So yeah, pays the dream, like you said. So that's kind of where that work came about.

Winston Benjamin 14:46 I realized that you said 20 years of outside and now you're back in a classroom and all these other things. So you've had now. Just your first change into the class. You also had a secondary or multiple changes. You made a change to become a Senior Learning Designer at AVID. Why did you decide to take on that challenge, and what did you learn from that experience?

Doug Ferguson 15:15 I was starting to get a little antsy after four years, and I was doing a lot of side work, consulting for some organizations, like, like, AVID, but I was still passionate about what I was doing with the kids, too. And there were some particular instances that were really powerful and and then some people raised some questions of, like, "Well, why are you doing this? Just for this one one school, can't you do? Can you help out more kids?" And the kind of me thinking, well, maybe I could. The opportunity to AVID kind of presented itself. They're looking to expand their work in STEM, you know, I wanted to do the curriculum or PD design, and figured they would train me. And so it just be a good chance to try something new, kind of explore that side of education and learn more about how that works, and that, that kind of, that's kind of what led to that. I ended up, it ended up being a really deep learning experience, because it kind of got thrown more in the deep end, but than I expected, yeah, but it was that was kind of the impetus behind that change.

Paul Beckermann 16:26 So now you've moved back to the classroom, and you kind of alluded to this a little bit earlier, Doug. You said that that move back kind of affirmed to you that you were meant to be a teacher in many ways. But why did you decide to go back, and what was that move back like?

Doug Ferguson 16:38 Yeah, no, I mentioned that there were a couple of powerful experiences I had as an instructional coach, and begin to see some things. And, you know, I don't even in that position. I missed the relationship with the kids, and I there was, you remind me of a story that maybe helps illustrate it. There was a student, and this is where I think everything kind of came together to me, I think in terms of what you can do, in terms of showing kids and believing them. Ironically, her name was Destiny, and we were just starting out with the robotics piece and doing a part of after school thing, and Destiny came in, and she immediately told us, "I'm no good at math, I'm no good at science. I can't do this. I'm not going to do it". And went and sat in the corner, yeah. Sat in the corner, said, "Okay, well, we'll give her some time, hope she warms up".

And she's kind of slowly did. And Destiny was a kiddo that she was getting ones on her, her standardized test scores, and she was people were pouring into her from, you know, the whole school wide. So there wasn't any one thing, but I remember that she kind of became curious about the robotics piece, seeing the kids doing it. She figured out that she could do it, and then she likes to become our spokesperson for the program. And she just has this confidence about her afterwards, because she was the person that could explain the programming and the robotics and everything. And it showed up elsewhere with her math work, whatnot. And she actually ended up going on. She went from ones to fours in a year. Wow. And a big part of that, I have to believe, was confidence and belief in herself. I can't part of the STEM work, and it's just kind of a magical thing. And I I really missed that when I was out of the classroom, out of school setting entirely. I mean, I loved being able to do the work I was, and I learned a ton from people and getting interactive educators across the country and whatnot, but it's just not the same, you know, and that that was a huge draw to go back in was, "okay, I want to, I want to work with kids again. I want to, you know, did my five years at AVID, it was a great experience. I grew, and now I want to get back in. I wanted to be working with kids and learning and growing and doing new things and having those aha moments," and that was a big, big part of the reason that I transitioned back in.

Rena Clark 18:49 Awesome, nice. Well, including myself and many people probably listening. I know, at least in Washington, with lots of budget cuts, many of us are transitioning back into the classroom, and we would like some, you know, helpful advice now that you're back in the classroom. What are the changes you noticed, especially, maybe you kind of talked about it a little bit, what has stayed the same? Or maybe even some advice for somebody that's going back in the classroom after being out for a while, like, what are like, the highest leverage things we need to know?

Doug Ferguson 19:25 You know, I I'm learning that I'm no expert. It's a humbling job. And I felt like being a first year teacher again, that first year, it really did the, you know, it wasn't. I was in the classroom for 10 years, and I was out of the classroom for just shy of 10 years. And man, there are things that are like muscle memory, but they kind of atrophy, so you got to rework and build those skills like classroom management, whatnot. I was, I was way too nice to the kid to when I was asking things to the kids when I first came in. "Please, could you do this?" Or they just kind of look at me, like, "no", so a.

Rena Clark 20:07 Little bit of trench bowl.

Doug Ferguson 20:08 Okay, yeah. Okay, okay. Look at that teacher voice again. And, you know, like, I am in charge of the room, that sort of thing. And I can't remember, my teacher friends kept saying, "Oh, it's like riding a bike". You know, you'll get a look back here. You know, you'll get back into it. And I'm like, and then I remember, I was at this training for the district to go back, and they had a poster on the wall, and it was, it said, "Yeah, teaching is like writing a bike". "Oh, great". I'm hearing this everywhere. But I kept reading, it's like, it's like riding a bike, except the bike's on fire. You're on fire. Everything's on fire, right? That's the urgency of like, I got to do all these things, and I have, you know, this classroom full of people dependent upon me, that I got to make sure I'm meeting as many needs as I can.

And so I think going back in, like, best advice I could say, is give yourself grace. You know, it's okay to be a new teacher again, um, and look with new eyes. And you also, I think you learned some things and, you know, you didn't, maybe get the first time around. And it takes time. It's, you know, I finally, after two years being back in, I finally feel like I'm starting to to pick up where I left off, you know, because there was a lot of frustration early on. I was like, I want to be the teacher I was 10 years ago. You know, I've been 10 years solid straight. I was a veteran. I just finished my national boards. I was doing my thing. And no, it's like, I'm just now getting there after two years. And so, you know, but I've learned a lot along the way. I've had some good opportunities for introspection, because way too long a tangent of story, but I ended up having a student teacher last year my first year back. Of.

Rena Clark 21:46 Course you did. That sounds about right on your story.

Doug Ferguson 21:49 Everything's on fire, yeah. And then I ended up having a student teacher again this year, so, but I learned a lot from them and with them and through that. And as far as the kids go, you know, they're different. I mean, kids are kids, right, no matter what, and so that doesn't change. But I think you have, I think the inputs and the societal pressures and stressors the last few years, right, there have been changes. You're still feeling the effects of COVID, for sure. There's that generational trauma. I think you have to account for the the social emotionally, the kids aren't were it's not like teaching fifth grade 10 years ago was. It felt like starting September with classical. More like, I mean, when I was a when I was a STEM instructional coach. I did every grade, so I got to get a good feel for it. It felt like more third grade beginning of the year. So helping them with some of those social, emotional learning, things they wouldn't necessarily had to do before at fifth grade, like how to how to work together, how to collaborate, how to, you know, talk with your teammates at your table group. Maybe I remember being funnier, but they don't get my jokes.

Paul Beckermann 23:04 Oh, come on, Doug, you're funny.

Doug Ferguson 23:08 I mean, they started to like around like April, whereas before it was usually like, with fifth grade, it was like, maybe like around December, like, because I used to like my ideal age range, I think is like second half of fifth grade, first half of sixth, right? Because spring is six. Like, man, they're middle schoolers, full on. But the that was the kind of humor where I landed, and now it's like, maybe, like May, June, they start to think I'm funny, or they or that point, they just feel, you know, a whole lot of pity and sympathy.

Doug Ferguson 23:42 I All right, cue the fake laughter. Oh,

Winston Benjamin 23:46 real. That is so real.

Doug Ferguson 23:54 And the plus have my book of dad jokes I pull out occasionally just read from it, you to one computing. So I oversaw the implementation of one-to-one computing at my last school. I didn't have it in the classroom. I was close. I had like, one-to-two computing with iPads and things, but, but actually having it as part of my classroom routine and how I manage it and everything, even though I had taught teachers how to do that, that was still learning curve for me personally. So that was interesting. Fidgets everywhere, like, like, I don't know what, maybe it's where I'm at. I mean, because it's always, no, it's everywhere, everywhere. Okay, I know it's like my one district, so never know what's commonplace what's not. But yeah, it's like every fidget you can imagine. So getting some knowing it going in, what your parameters are going to be around, managing that because, like everything, like it's a fidget, like, it's not a fidget that's like, you're going to launch that across the classroom. That's good and badly. Attendance issues, right? Um. That's huge. You know, just little things to try and remind the kids when we did everybody there, like saying how important is, and we're only as smart as as good as we can be when everybody's here. And I had a little dance button. There's a 30-second dance party that, if we had already here, we'd hit that when we were lining up in the morning. So little things like that to try and, you know,

Paul Beckermann 25:20 hey, Rena, Sky One.

Unknown Speaker 25:22 Rena, yes, that's the exact one I have right.

Paul Beckermann 25:30 There. Yeah, we're all dancing.

Rena Clark 25:34 Best. I helps with the management. I use it all the time. High schoolers like it too, even if they pretend.

Doug Ferguson 25:41 Oh yeah, they love to pretend. But no, they do. They do, yeah. And I think also attention spans a little shorter, you know, kids a little lonelier. On the positive side, they're nicer than I remember. So I don't know if that just struck me, at least where I'm at, like they do seem genuinely kinder to each other. So that's, that's good. I think the work we're doing with growing them, with, you know, the social, emotional learning is really is paying off. And maybe there's some other changes too that are broader, but, yeah, those are the big things. But, yeah, I mean, at the end of the day, just know that you can't do it all. It's an impossible job, and you're just doing the best you can and give yourself permission to be,

Rena Clark 26:19 you know, sounds like we could, we could have, like, a support group or online community for that, right? It's like a unique situation.

Doug Ferguson 26:31 It is. But, yeah, there's nothing better than being in the classroom at the end of the day when the kids are, you know, you've worked with those kids, and you just see like that, a ha moment, or that magical moment, or that spark. You know, there's just no substitute for that. So that's something to look forward to and get you through all the other stuff.

Rena Clark 26:49 Can I have a follow? Like, I'm just curious, because I know there's something I experienced, like being distance, like, you know, you're helping a large group or doing but you never get to, like, see those moment. You never get to like, see the fruits, whereas in the classroom, do you get to like, experience that more? That's direct alignment to like seeing as you're talking about these stories,

Doug Ferguson 27:11 I think, I mean, I think so. I think you get to, I mean, there's, I think you build the relationships with the kids, and so you get a little bit more in the way of you get to, I think, see a little bit more of their journey long term as well as the short term pieces. There's a couple of things that come to mind, as far as that goes, the, you know, being back in now, and the kind of shorter term pieces I've had a couple kids say with math science, you know, "I didn't, I didn't really get it before, but the way you explain it, it's making sense to me". And every teacher connects differently with with different kids, right? And so, but just that, that's kind of cool, right? I get to be that person that's that spark for that kid to like, "hey, this actually makes sense" and and I, when kiddo came, came in this year, to me, I a little bit of a rascal, right? And that's what it is. What it is, yeah? Like, I like to call it job security, yeah. And I sometimes look around, I'm like, they're all acting like a bunch of fifth graders. Oh, wait, they are fifth graders, but he and I connected, and he started getting really serious about his math work, and he moved out of the he was in a tier, tier two intervention, so he was in a small group for math support, and he actually graduated out of that. And then he started growing his confidence, and then he became a leader in the classroom for math. And this little rascal went from two on his fourth grade SBA math to four on his SBA this year in math. I mean, just grew two levels and just and you can see it. There's confidence and answering questions. And it was just really fun to see, you know, and you get to those little moments with, you know, with the kids bonding and, and we, we this whole joke. We just like career activity thing where they got to have a dream job and then an actual job, and they budgeted out. And his dream job was to be an actor and be Spider-Man. So he was writing Spider-Man on his math journal under the name, right? And so I just leaned into him, just real quietly, went whispered in his ear, "I am Spider-Man" and grew up loving it. And you know that culmination, that whole year of relationship, right? Where you do something silly like that, and then it's just like this magical moment for you know that's in addition to all the math and stuff you did, but.

Paul Beckermann 29:45 Hey, that's as good as a dad joke, Doug. That's as good as a joke.

Rena Clark 29:51 Maybe better, perfect.

Winston Benjamin 29:58 All right, so I'm gonna. To try to ask this question in a way that kind that validates your experience, but also tries to maybe pull out some things where another teacher could get some advice from you on how to do it. You spoke about STEM a lot. You spoke about integrating a robotics program and the young lady who learned and was pushed and became and found herself in that robotics program, right? You've spoken about the value of them. How have you developed the opportunities to integrate STEM into your classroom? Is it like just throwing it out there to somebody, or is it trying it and seeing, asking for forgiveness, not permission? Like, what are some of the things that really helped you be able to integrate STEM into your classroom?

Doug Ferguson 30:51 Yeah, that's absolutely and it's been, you know, when I was first in the classroom, I was able to kind of build up study supply of materials and things, and then I left the classroom. And so I'm rebuilding, right? And also in terms of location, like you said, permission and versus asking forgiveness, and, you know, a little bit of both, of course. But I was lucky in that where I landed the my current principal, who I just, I think is I'm just, I'm very lucky. I'm where I'm at, super supportive. Knows where my interests are as far as that. And sometimes I forget to ask. I go afterwards. He's just like, that's okay. I know what you're doing. It's good. You know, as long as it's you know your standards base you're you're crossing your T's and dotting your I's in terms of safety and things you're good.

And so it's just looking for little things. Feeling a new teacher, right? ELA is curriculum. Learn again. And so they're trying to figure out, okay, where are the opportunities, where I can find some space for things? And so I started out smaller coding. I think is a great way to kind of weave in some some some early opportunities. And I try and think of it. I mean, at first it's kind of learning to code with the basics. And you can whether it's Code.org or Scratch or MakeCode or something else, but then trying to move that, that along to a point where you can do from learning to code to coding to learn and figure out little projects for the kids or challenges or opportunities for them to present.

And so I with with that, I really only had to take like a finding, carve out time for a lesson or two in the fall, get them up and running whatever platform it was, and then that could be one of their choices if they finished their work early. But I have a little math menu that I have math time or science menu for science time and is one of the choices they could do and then work towards making like a presentation. I saved a few resources along the way to have have those. Also DonorsChoose opportunities, but then also being okay with like, you know, it doesn't need to be fancy or flashy or expensive to be a really good use of time in terms of integrated STEM activities, like you can, you can, you can do a paper airplane engineering activity.

And so trying to be creative about where does it match with my standards and with my curriculum? And, you know, is it? Sometimes it's a one-off lesson, like you mentioned. Sometimes I did after school club both years to kind of get some time where I had a little more freedom. Now that I know the curriculum better, I'm able to weave a lot more in, plus being math being a math science teacher, it's easy excuse for me to integrate with investigations and things. After SBA time is my experimental time. Tell the kids you know something along the lines of, you know, you're gonna be my guinea pigs now we're going to try some things. And so like, it's like squeezing in one hour, one lesson after another of like, like we did this year, because I'm trying to get ready for next year. As far as I want to do some mini PBL integration next year. But we did a day with robotics. We did a day with programming, video games on MakeCode Arcade. We did a day with hands-on Snap Circuits for electronics. We did a day with 3D printing design and printed off a few other creations from the sea. And so just it was like, "Okay, this is the time I have at the end of the year". I have carte blanche to really work out some kinks and then start to do some some integration, more thorough integration next year.

Paul Beckermann 34:22 Cool stuff. Say we got one more question for you, Doug, before we hop into our toolkit, because want to bring this up, because I know you've been working on another huge project in your educational career. You're working on your doctorate program. You want to tell us a little bit about that journey? So yeah, that's,

Doug Ferguson 34:38 yeah, that's been, and that's been another part of the interesting journey with being back in the classroom. Back in the classroom is I have to. I have kids this time around, right? I didn't have kids the last time. That changes things definitely, maybe a better teacher, but I have to manage my time, and then also working on my doctorate, and now, through all my classes, finished all my exams and everything. So it's just focused on the dissertation and the research. And and this is actually part of what drew me back to the classroom, a little bit is be closer to my research, but I'm working on doing a case study of a positive outlier school and trying to add to the literature on that for positive outlier schools and school districts, and basically schools and school districts to perform significantly higher than demographically similar schools, and looking at, you know, what do they do? What does that look like? And then, what are the big takeaways? And how can we take that and apply that, you know? How can I apply that as a classroom teacher where I'm at, how can I share things with my building principal, like, "Hey, this is lessons learned"? And what are some things maybe, that, you know, with the, I mean, a smaller district, so I get to collaborate with district leadership, so as an executive, share with them too, along those lines? That's, that's kind of it in a nutshell. I could talk about that forever. So I'm happy to speak as much or as little as you want to hear.

Paul Beckermann 35:49 We may have to have you back some time to talk about what you actually find from that research. That sounds fascinating.

Doug Ferguson 35:55 It's, I've learned a ton, and it's, it's, it's interesting, because the second school I taught at, it actually is a positive outlier. And so the the there aren't many case studies in the literature, and so I'm actually doing a case study on that school over a 10 year period. And I spent roughly 200 hours in the office of superintendents for Washington State's their their database, going over test scores, looking at comparisons, whatnot. And there's the school right where I taught. They were national Title One school, and they were actually in the top 10 school Title One schools in the state for 10 year period straight, like so really amazing work that they've done. And then it's interesting, because there are definitely some things you can just you can you can take and apply wherever you're at.

Winston Benjamin 36:41 That's awesome again. It goes back to your original statement, which is probably going to be in my toolkit, or in my one thing, but it's time for the toolkit.

Transition Music with Rena's Children 36:52 Check it out. Check it out. Check it out. Check it out. What's in the toolkit? What is in the toolkit? Check it out.

Winston Benjamin 37:04 Rena, Paul, what's in your toolkit?

Paul Beckermann 37:07 I'm gonna drop a perspective in the toolkit, because I just think it's great hearing from other teachers, like listening to you, Doug, and your experiences. I can learn from that. And that's that's super powerful. I feel like when I was a classroom teacher, I was so locked in my classroom on a day to day basis, just surviving. You know, from one period to the next, you don't get a chance to really hear what your colleagues are doing, to see them in action, but any opportunity that you get to step outside of your own classroom and interact with other teachers just in conversation, or, better yet, get into their classrooms, it's so powerful, and I think you're kind of doing that same thing with your dissertation. You know, you're, you're stepping out and you're, you're seeing what's happening in these classrooms to see what makes a difference. That's really cool.

Rena Clark 37:54 Yeah, and it's interesting going back in, because you've had the opportunity to step out and see so much. So I think that's why it's hard to go back in because you know so much and you want to do so much, but we'll talk about that later. But for me, in the toolkit anyways, just some things that might be helpful. Is, if you go to AVID Open Access, we have digital templates. So there's a ton of digital templates. Or even as you go back and start the beginning of the year and create some of those routines, or want to build relationships and relational capacity activities, there's things available.

Winston Benjamin 38:28 So I'm gonna steal something from your early career, which is the vet that you leaned on, especially in the special education department. Reach out to the people in the building. You have the most amount of tools that you could ever use. They are sharp, they are ready, and they can build a house and build a school. So use those voices, use those resources, and think about how to reach all of the kids. Um, I.

Paul Beckermann 39:01 I see what you did there, Winston. Sharp tools. See, you were gonna sneak that in there, but I got it.

Winston Benjamin 39:09 Paul, sometimes you pay attention. So Doug, what's in your toolkit? What would you like to add? Other than the amount of information that you've provided us today, what would something else you would like to add?

Doug Ferguson 39:20 Yeah, no, I appreciate that. And in line with with Paul, was what you're saying, you know, doesn't have to be cutting edge. The wealth of knowledge in your just in your building, like you were saying when I was a STEM instructional coach, that was, like, the best PD ever, because I got to co- and co-teach with these teachers, and I learned so much, and there was so much to learn. And, yeah, it's just, it's just, it's amazing. We get wrapped up in our classrooms, and we sometimes forget how much experience and knowledge is just down the hall, right? And I think same for folks who you know, once you step out of the classroom, it's so important to get back in, right, to get that fresh perspective and those fresh ideas and whatnot. And so I think that's that's just a huge tool in your toolkit. Is that right in that person, right next.

Paul Beckermann 40:13 Door? All right, great tools today. Let's hop into our one thing.

Transition Music with Rena's Children 40:19 It's time for that one thing, that one thing,

Paul Beckermann 40:31 all right, one thing time. Rena, you want to start? What's your final thought today?

Rena Clark 40:36 Well, personally, I'm taking away that word "grace". So I love the fact that you you know, we have these expectations. We talked to another guest, and they're like, you know, put your money your mouth. You have the opportunity now to apply all the things that you've been learning and teaching, but give yourself grace, because you're not going to be able to do it all at once. And I know I'm like that. Many people, we want to do all the things right now, because that's what's best for kids, but giving yourself grace and learning from others and easing into it and knowing that, just like when we started that first year teaching, there's going to be some time for us to adjust.

Paul Beckermann 41:11 Winston, what are you thinking about?

Winston Benjamin 41:14 I'm at the back end, maybe this part of Doug's career. It's the recognize when to ask for permission and when to ask for forgiveness. Sometimes it's okay to jump when you think you know something good for the kids, and you can back it up, right? Once you can demonstrate that it's valuable, then you can move forward in other ways, but at least try something. Collect the data on the thing you tried and try to show somebody else that it's beneficial for your kids. You know them better than anybody else. So like, at least try something instead of just say, "I can't do anything".

Paul Beckermann 41:58 Kind of like your personal action research there, Winston.

Winston Benjamin 42:02 Absolutely, absolutely. I am pondering the two big student stories that Doug shared, Destiny and the rascal.

Paul Beckermann 42:13 That could be like a band name, Destiny and the Rascal.

Rena Clark 42:20 Yeah, other than the band name, I'm just thinking about, kind of the similarity of their trajectories. You know, they they were both struggling academically, and then, you know, through some connection with their teacher, they started to gain some belief in their self, in themselves, and they kind of eventually led to thrive through a leadership position. And if you think about that arc, it's kind of a model in how we can build kids up. If we can give them some esteem building so that they really feel pride in what they're doing, they can grow leaps and bounds. And I saw that in those two stories. So kudos to you, Doug, for for helping those kids, but and also for sharing that story. You get to play too, Doug. What do you want to? All right, end with final thoughts for our listeners today?

Doug Ferguson 43:08 I think to that end like belief, you never know what seed that's going to plant. I remember a student my first year who school wasn't necessarily his thing. And then we had a tech program we got connected with, and I went to his mom, was like, "you gotta sign up for this". This is and and it really built him up. And told my, you know, this is amazing for you. And you know, the there's a Maya Angelou quote, I think, is, you know that people forget what you said. They'll forget what you did, but Right? But they, they they won't forget how you made them feel. And so just really built them up with that. And he's one, I actually got to see where it went. And he went on to be a, like a system administrator leading a tech group and just doing amazing things. And, you know, a kiddo that was not like school was kind of floundering. And then that belief, right? And that feeling carried him through. So you never know, as a teacher, what's gonna you know what's gonna do, but you gotta, you gotta keep playing those seats.

Rena Clark 44:13 Well. Thank you for joining us today, Doug, and sharing your your story, the ins and outs. I know we've all learned something. Take something with us, and maybe we'll have you back to learn about how that dissertation goes. Yeah, I.

Doug Ferguson 44:27 I appreciate it's like, you know, I'm just the classroom teacher next door, right? There's, there's, there's teacher just next door to, you know, next door to be next to everyone, next to our listeners that has all these things to share and just go.

Paul Beckermann 44:39 Out of conversation. All right, well, we're all stepping outside our door and giving you a big thumbs up for the episode today. Doug, thanks so much. Thanks, everyone.

Rena Clark 44:46 Thanks for listening to Unpacking Education.

Winston Benjamin 44:50 We invite you to visit us at avidopenaccess.org where you can discover resources to support student agency and academic tenacity. To create a classroom for future-ready learners.

Paul Beckermann 45:02 We'll be back here next Wednesday for a fresh episode of Unpacking Education.

Rena Clark 45:07 And remember, "Go forth and be awesome".

Winston Benjamin 45:11 Thank you for all you do.

Paul Beckermann 45:13 You make a difference.